Use of the "Pool Frog"
- Thread starter chdolfnz
- Start date
Waterbear: I am a newbie at pools so I appreciate you educating me on a pool that is clear does not mean it is clean. Anyways, (I know I am going to get the business for this) but, I do test with the strips (5 measures) and they come in right in the "ok" range. What else can I do aside from buying an expensive test system? Am I really missing something if the test strips tell me everything is in the ok range? I want to learn, so please inform me. I'll tell you what I have do since getting installed last summer: Run the aquasmarte, use "Blast" once a week and run pump daily to turn water. No chlorine smell, test strips "ok" and water is absolutely crystal clear. Let me know what I might be missing. I am all for saving money, but I also am one that if it is working like this I don't want to mess with a good thing... Also, I did bring a sample to pool store and amazingly they said "wow, your water is reading perfect" no metals...etc...
Thanks.
Thanks.
ddpool said:
I'll chime in. Your water didn't test for metals because you don't have a fresh cartridge in the cannister.
I used strips too. They always said "ok" for all ranges. I started having issues in my third year. Up until then I thought the system was great. Year 5, my strips still said "ok", specifically that the CYA was in the 30-50 range. In reality, after tests from the pool store and my eventual kit, my CYA was well over one hundred. The strips said my PH was ok but it was actually 6.8.
The bac pacs contain trichlor, which lower ph and raise CYA. If these numbers are not monitored properly (with a proper test kit- not strips) you can damage your pool (low ph) and end up with overstabilization which means "normal" levels of FC are not effective.
The Truth about Alternative Sanitizers article is in further reading in Pool School, (Edit) and also this article here and they were enough to convince me and (End Edit) it explains why the recommended low levels of FC that the manufacturer, King Technologies gives of .5-1 FC are not only unsanitary, they aren't safe at all. And for them to say "don't swim until your FC drops to 1-3 ppm" without even mentioning the relative CYA level is downright irresponsible.
Test kits aren't expensive. The TF-100 is less than $70 and will typically last 2 seasons if stored properly (and there aren't unusual situations like algae, baq conversions or CYA adjustments, these issues use up the specific test reagents quicker). I admit I too balked at the price of the kit at first, but once I had one I totally understood why I needed it and wondered why it took me so long to order it.
It allowed me to take total control of my pool, no more guessing and no more relying on the inexperienced and unhelpful pool store employees who job it is to sell me chems! Chems I didn't even need! 
Yes, I was "pool stored" and more than once. So I'll admit I am bitter. :grrrr: I can tell you I have saved hundreds and hundreds of dollars by abandoning the Frog, switching to BBB and investing in the test kit. The test kit was the smartest thing I have done in relation to my pool, aside from joining this forum.
Inline chlorinators that use trichlor are a perfectly acceptable form of chlorination, provided one understands the chemistry associated with using one and has an appropriate test kit to monitor the PH and CYA. Frog, Aquasmart, N2, and other "mineral systems" - they are plain and simple money makers for the pool stores and the stuff they put in your pool is not only useless in most cases but totally uneccessary, proper levels of FC, by way of liquid chlorine a.k.a. bleach, do the exact same thing.
Ok, end rant
What FPM said. She and I have had almost the same experience more or less with the Pool Frog/ AquaSmarte system. I thought a good test kit was way expensive too, until I opened up the pool on my third year, and the water was cloudy. Took a sample to be tested, and came home with approximately $100 worth of chems to be added to the water - namely, an algaecide and some calcium. Add in the bucket of Blast and a six pack of bac pacs, and that was another $150 - $200 or so. I ended up fighting a running battle with a cloudy pool all year. I used the test strips, and everything was "OK".
What brought me to Pool Forum and ultimately to TFP was ironically my pump. I just couldnt' see running a pump 24x7, thought it was a huge waste of electricity. So, after settling my pump issue, I started reading about BBB, and it made perfect sense. I ended up getting a Taylor K-2005 (thought I was getting a K-2006), bought the FAS-DPD agents separately, and started properly testing the water and adding only what was needed. I added a saltwater chlorine generator a couple of years ago to take care of my chlorine demand, so all I really add during the year is some muriatic acid and borax when needed to maintain my pH, and even then it doesn't drift much. I only had to shock when I opened and closed the pool last year and maybe one other time during the summer, if that. So, my yearly expenses using the Aqua Smarte without any additional chemicals were around $200 - $300 or so. With BBB, maybe $50-$100?? and that's if I have to shock the pool. This year, I didn't even have to shock the pool when I opened. I had residual FC left from when I closed the pool 6 months ago, and no CC. The best benefit by far though is I control my water balance.
OK, I'll get off FPMom's soapbox now, too. Time to go walk the dog, in fact.
What brought me to Pool Forum and ultimately to TFP was ironically my pump. I just couldnt' see running a pump 24x7, thought it was a huge waste of electricity. So, after settling my pump issue, I started reading about BBB, and it made perfect sense. I ended up getting a Taylor K-2005 (thought I was getting a K-2006), bought the FAS-DPD agents separately, and started properly testing the water and adding only what was needed. I added a saltwater chlorine generator a couple of years ago to take care of my chlorine demand, so all I really add during the year is some muriatic acid and borax when needed to maintain my pH, and even then it doesn't drift much. I only had to shock when I opened and closed the pool last year and maybe one other time during the summer, if that. So, my yearly expenses using the Aqua Smarte without any additional chemicals were around $200 - $300 or so. With BBB, maybe $50-$100?? and that's if I have to shock the pool. This year, I didn't even have to shock the pool when I opened. I had residual FC left from when I closed the pool 6 months ago, and no CC. The best benefit by far though is I control my water balance.
OK, I'll get off FPMom's soapbox now, too. Time to go walk the dog, in fact.
As far as buying an 'expensive' test kit...a good test kit will cost substantially less than ONE replacement cart for your private label poolfrog (which is what you have!)ddpool said:
The trichlor you are using will eventually lead to an overstabilized pool, often by one swimming season. The metals you are putting in your water are an algaecide so your pool won't turn green but if you think your water is sanitized when this happens you are kidding yourself. (IF the pool store found no metals in your water that is because they did not test for silver and zinc which is what your system uses!)
Blast is just a non chlorine shock (MPS). It oxidizes organics but does not really sanitize and can lower pH, just like the trichlor. It also adds sulfates to your water, which can be a problem in some cases.
I suggest you read the Pool School section of the forum and learn how the pool pros take care of pools since it's the easiest and most cost effective way to do it in the long run!
If the system you are using actually worked then there would not be a need for TFP! Think about that!
Edit: Blast is cal hypo.
Thanks for all the great help! I am definitely leaning towards BBB. I will get the good test kit and see where everything is. Like I said, I am a newbie and seeing as though the water looks, feels great and the strips were coming in the ok range...I didn't want to ruin a good thing. But, I will try out the test kit and let you all know where I am. Thanks again!
ddpool said:
I think you will be surprised at how far off your test strips are...I used strips on my pool last year the first week because I had not gotten even a cheap kit. However, while the strips had things way low...I was glad that I didn't start adding stuff, because the actual kit showed things were right on target. Rely on a good kit.
I had severe problems with the Nature2 system that came free with my new pool in 2004. Pool was only three weeks old when I had to travel for 2 weeks. Cartridge failed while I was gone and all the little metal balls blew out the returns, rolled merrily down the pool bottom, and most got sucked into the main drain and back into the pump trap five feet from where they started. Metal levels went through the roof and I had nice black stains that required acid start-up and much sequestrant to resolve. I took the little balls down to the Pool Store Guy and he knew exactly what they were, because apparently it happens a lot. Anthony-Sylvan did step up and do the stain removal, and THEY said it happens a lot. I never used it again and have since ripped it out.
We have a frog system and it is tricky as to balance. Right now we are fighting cloudy water. The stories you get as to what is acceptable is all over the place. You see the chemical stores are use to the normal pool setup not the Frog. So you over dose every chemical.