Pentair Easytouch Power at Panel but nothing runs

[Gudhjem]

Hi troublefreepool troubleshooters.

I have power at the control panel of my Pentair Easytouch with no error messages on the display. None of the panel button has any effect. The filter pump, cleaner pump, jets, lights all do not react when their button is pressed, and the buttons do not light. The hardwired remote panel also shows "NO COMM" and cannot control anything. I can also access via my phone, but cannot control anything. Also, the 3A Relays breaker in the upper right cluster of the panel is tripped (see pic), and when reset will retrip after a few seconds. A visual inspection behind the panel covers revealed nothing obviously unusual (no burnt wires, disconnects).

I've reset power with no effect.

Obviously the tripped breaker indicates a relay may be a problem, but all of them all at once seems extremely unlikley. The fact that it's everything also makes troubleshooting individual pumps or lights unnecessary.

I would appreciate any thoughts on where to begin troubleshooting this.

Thanks in advance.

--Steve

 

[ajw22]

Welcome to TFP.

The tripped 3A CB is for the high voltage AUX relays controlled by the buttons. That is why none of the buttons work.

Turn off power to the EasyTouch. Open the top low voltage panel and disconnect all the relays from the board. You may want to label each wire with what AUX number it is connected to before disconnecting. Then power up the panel and see if the breaker resets.

If it does then connect one relay at a time and see which one is tripping the breaker.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Steve,

Do what Allen recommends above and see what happens.

I suspect that with all the relays disconnected, the breaker will still pop.

If it does, it most likely means that the IC chips that drive the relays are bad. The good news is that these chips are the only two chips that are in sockets, so they can be easily replaced.

Please let us know what you find and we can go from there..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Gudhjem]

Thanks for the great responses, and within minutes. Just wow. Thanks both of you.

I disconnected all the relays, powered the system back up, reset the breaker, and it still popped, as Jim suspected it would. Where are these IC chips you speak of?

 

[ajw22]

If you have isolated an AUX circuit not turning on to the board it may be due to a blow driver chip.

Help! My aux circuits (or valves) stopped working!! describes how to replace the ULN2803A relay driver chip.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Steve,

The chips are on the LCD side of the main card...

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Gudhjem]

Thanks for the guidance. I've ordered the chips, I'll post here how it goes.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Steve,

Did one of the chips look bad??

Did you note how they were installed.. Just asking because when you install the new ones, they can be easily put in 180 degrees out...

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Gudhjem]

Did one of the chips look bad??

No, not to my eye. see pics. No obvious problems on board either.

Did you note how they were installed.. Just asking because when you install the new ones, they can be easily put in 180 degrees out...

I did, thanks for the tip.

 

[Gudhjem]

UPDATE: Installed the new chips. 3Z breaker does not trip. Reconnected all of the relays, still does not trip. So far so good! However, the filter pump still does not run. Several other devices now do (lights, spa jets pump), but not the filter pump or the cleaner pump. The lights above the buttons for each of them do light now, and the SWG comes on when I turn the filter pump on. The hardwired remote panel also still shows "NO COMM".

Also, after removing the old chips, I noticed what looked like burn marks on the socket (see pic).

Any thoughts on what to try next? Seems like the pump motor may have gone bad, but seems unlikely TWO pumps went bad at the same time, as well as the board chip.

Thanks.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Steve,

Two different issues.. The chips you replaced have nothing to do with the com port.

I suspect that something on the RS-485 com port has gone bad. The problem is that anything on the bus can load the whole thing down.

The standard troubleshooting for no com is to disconnect everything from J20 com port except just the main IntelliFlo pump.. Then with the system in AUTO and Pool, see what the pump's display shows. It should show "Display not active".. If it does, it means the main card and pump are good. If it does not, it means the main card or the pump is bad.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Gudhjem]

Thanks Jim.

My J20 com port has 2 things connected -- an external wifi adapter I added years ago, and a connection to a comm port on another board, which I think is the SWG board (see pic). In other words, my IntelliFlo pump does not seem to connect directly to the J20. Also connected to the SWG board on different comm ports is the hardwired remote, and the IntelliFlo pump (I'm pretty sure, hard to trace the wire under the concrete).

I disconnected the hardwired remote and the wifi adapter, which I think leaves just the IntelliFlo pump connected, albeit through the SWG board. The display shows "AUTO" and then when I try to turn on the pump it also shows "POOL" (see pic). The pump display shows 0 RPM, the time, 0 watts (you do mean the LCD display on the pump itself right? see pic). I don't see any "Display not active" language, but it is still connected via the SWG board.

I discovered the pump does work. I can operate it by using the buttons at the pump itself. I just can't operate it from the panel (or remote, or schedule it).

Thoughts? Would it help troubleshooting if I connect the pump directly to the main board to bypass the SWG board?

Thanks.
--Steve

 

[Jimrahbe]

Steve,

The whole point of connecting just the pump to J20 is to eliminate all the the other stuff that is on the RS-485 bus..

You can't do the test if anything else is connected to J20 other than the pump. You should be able to disconnect the pump connector from the SWCG card and plug it into J20,,

The fact that you have an RPM screen, instead of a "Display not active" screen, means your pump is not being controled by the EasyTouch.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Gudhjem]

Right.

I disconnected the pump from the SWCG board (not a plug, just two wires, yellow and green), and connected them to the J20 comm port on the main board. That's now the only thing connected to the J20.
Same result as above -- The pump display shows 0 RPM. As you say, it's still not being controlled by the EasyTouch.

Does this mean my main board is bad? Anything else I can check before drawing that $800 conclusion?

Thanks.

--Steve

 

[Jimrahbe]

Steve,

That proves that the pump and the EasyTouch are not talking...

Could be either the pump or the main card, hard to tell, but 90% of the time it is the main card

Another thing that you can do is this..

Connect just the RS-485 jumper wire from J20 to the surge card. Make sure none of the other RS-485 devices are connected to the surge card.

At this point the only thing on the RS-485 buss is the SWCG. Use the little LCD and adjust the SWCG's output up and down and confirm that the sanitizer lights change as they should... If the lights change, then most likely your main board is ok.. If they do not change, it is a pretty good indication that the RS-485 chips on the main card are bad.

Another thing to check is the pump cable itself.. We have seen a couple of times where the cable connects to the pump is all corroded, so you want to inspect that connection and make sure it is ok.

Let's see if Tom has any ideas on repair of the main card... Calling @ogdento

Another option is to upgrade to the new IntelliCenter..

IntelliCenter Upgrade Kits

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Gudhjem]

Thanks Jim. I'll try the isolation exercise you describe tonight.

Note that it's not only the IntelliFlo pump that is not resonding to the Easytouch. The pool sweep pump also does not respond, and the hardwired remote is not communicating with the panel either. I've not isolated either of these as I have with the IntelliFlo, but those devices also not working would indicate main card, not IntelliFlo pump, I would think.

--Steve

 

[Jimrahbe]

Steve,

It does sound like your main card is bad..

The problem is that if you have say 5 'things' connected to the RS-485 bus, anyone of them being bad can cause all of them not to work..

That is why you have to disconnect everything from the bus and then try one thing at a time. The pump just happens to be something that you can look at and see right away if it is taking to the EasyTouch or not.

Most the time it is one of the transceiver antennas either for ScreenLogic or for a Pentair remote.

But not this time..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Gudhjem]

Connect just the RS-485 jumper wire from J20 to the surge card. Make sure none of the other RS-485 devices are connected to the surge card.

At this point the only thing on the RS-485 buss is the SWCG. Use the little LCD and adjust the SWCG's output up and down and confirm that the sanitizer lights change as they should... If the lights change, then most likely your main board is ok.. If they do not change, it is a pretty good indication that the RS-485 chips on the main card are bad.

I did that this evening. No change to the SWCG's lights when adjusting at the panel. Unless @ogdento or some other wizard has a way that I can fix my main card, looks like a need a new one. For a couple hundred bucks more, I like the idea of the IntelliCenter Upgrade Kits. Thanks for pointing that out Jim. I have not been able to tell if my hardwired remote or my spa-side remote will work with that upgrade, or if all I really need to buy is that kit. Happen to know?

 

[ajw22]

. I have not been able to tell if my hardwired remote or my spa-side remote will work with that upgrade, or if all I really need to buy is that kit. Happen to know?

I am not sure what your hardwired remote is. If it is an Indoor Control Panel that will need to be replaced with the IntelliCenter ICP.

I think your spa side remote will work. Do you have the 4 button or 10 button spa remote?

 

[Gudhjem]

Yes, it is the Indoor Control Panel that came with the EasyTouch. The spa-side remote is a 4-button.