Outdoor Kitchen Counter Material - Lueder?

[joshlarsen]

Were in the build process for our pool, firepit, and outdoor kitchen. We never really discussed the type of material for our counter top with the PB but they are planning to install lueder. I have some concern with lueder being very porous and how bad the oils and grease from the gill will stain the lueder. Looking for other peoples experience on how lueder holds up and how bad it stains after a couple years of use. I know there is sealers and am sure resealing it every year will help but don't want to install it and have it look terrible after a short time(We grill alot). Figuring now is the time to switch to granite or quartzite or something else if we decide that would be better.

Pic of Outdoor Kitchen, More pics in pool build thread in signature.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Yikes, c-block … take it from, that’s a nightmare. Make sure all of your critical connection points for utilities (gas, electric, water, etc) have an easily accessible service door cut into the block. My BBQ deck was done in block and the gas shutoff was out way in the back near the wall with no easy access panel. It’s literally impossible to reach without having to have half your body inside the cabinet area. A better construction method would have been to use 18 gauge steel framing and cement board. Then you can finish it in stone, tile or whatever you like.

As for the counter top, we did a poured concrete base (with rebar) and then finished it in ceramic tile. Tile is super easy to clean and grease is not an issue. Lueders will be a nightmare.

 

[joshlarsen]

Yikes, c-block … take it from, that’s a nightmare. Make sure all of your critical connection points for utilities (gas, electric, water, etc) have an easily accessible service door cut into the block. My BBQ deck was done in block and the gas shutoff was out way in the back near the wall with no easy access panel. It’s literally impossible to reach without having to have half your body inside the cabinet area. A better construction method would have been to use 18 gauge steel framing and cement board. Then you can finish it in stone, tile or whatever you like.

As for the counter top, we did a poured concrete base (with rebar) and then finished it in ceramic tile. Tile is super easy to clean and grease is not an issue. Lueders will be a nightmare.

I agree that it would have been better to be built with a steel frame and cement board but it seems like this is a pretty standard built method in my area. I'm actually installing a pellet grill so only need electric but do have the ability to get gas to the kitchen pretty easily in the future if it was ever needed. Well see how the electrician runs the conduit but where the conduit comes up from under the deck it shouldn't be terrible bad to work with in the future.

I had not thought about tile but that is another good idea.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

I don’t have a good feeling for the grade behind that kitchen (looks like it drops off a cliff) but I would have then modify the back wall with at least one small access door on each wall so that you can reach in. A 6”x6” door is easy for short reaches but a 12”x12” works better for a whole arm. Believe me, trying to access anything from the front openings once doors, trays and cabinets are in place can be a contortionist’s nightmare. Access panels are easy to install now and a royal PITA to do later.

And yeah, even around here the builders go-to approach is c-block. A guy I know did his ODK in metal frame and cement board (water, electric, sewer/drains) and all the sides have removable panels that make getting to things a cinch. No bolts either, it’s all on hooks and rails so you just lift the panel up and pull it away. He finished it all in stacked stone fascia so you can’t even see the seems. Quality job but DIY on his part because he couldn’t find a contractor that wanted to work with him … or said differently, no contractor wanted to deal with him

 

[joshlarsen]

Honestly I wish I would have just had the PB put the pad in and built the kitchen myself but its to late now. I'm thinking I'm going to end up doing the counter top myself or through a diff company anyways. They seem to only want to do Lueder and I knew that was going to be a bad idea so thought I would ask to confirm it.

 

[Katodude]

I have quartzite on mine and it is great. It is very easy to clean and has held up well.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Honestly speaking, and no offense to you, but that block job looks like garbage … I think my teenager could do a better job. The mortar joints are all over the place in width, they used cut block to make up for short falls and the top is leveled out with varying thicknesses. It looks sloppy and thrown together, no plan. Obviously all that would be hidden behind whatever you finish it off with (my bet is they’d like to just throw stucco up on it and paint it to match the house) but the base job looks like . Seeing that, I wouldn’t trust them to finish it off properly.

You could broach the subject of just paying them for the materials used and then cancel that part of the contract. Jackhammer all that garbage out and then find someone else to do the job right. Where I live, there are several shops in town that do custom ODK work as their main business as well as supply retail stuff (grills, fireplaces, charcoal, pellets, fires glass, etc, etc).

 

[joshlarsen]

@JoyfulNoise I totally agree its def shoddy work. The backside will be covered with stucco to match the house and the front will have stack stone. I have a call out to the builder to see what they can come up with for counter top and if they cant I'll have to see if I can have them stop working on the kitchen, pay for what they have into it and built it myself. As it is I bought all the appliances and cabinet doors and all myself and have the skills to build it as well as access to a welder so its totally doable.

 

[Nectarologist]

I have soapstone for my countertop. Definitely unique for an outdoor kitchen; we love it. You can oil it with mineral oil to give it a nice dark color or leave it and it will look matte and light in color. The splatter from the grill give it a dark appearance near the grill or course but it blends in nicely even when the rest of the counter isn't oiled. That isn't permanent. Something like concrete can stain if not sealed. We go between oiled and not depending on how we feel. Mineral oil or grill grease washes out after a few weeks. Cost-wise it's similar to granite by me. I have quartz in my indoor kitchen and that was a little cheaper.

 

[jark87]

In regards to c-block vs steel frame, I went back and forth on it with our outdoor kitchen re-build. My previous kitchen was c-block with stone facing and probably would have lasted longer than me had we not decided to re-design, so that’s what I ultimately decided to do again, but with much nicer stone this time (thanks to my wife ).

The risk with steel is rust. Yes, builders will tell you that they’ll use “rust proof” galvanized steel, but I’ve seen too many that rusted in the drill and cut spots, especially in high humidity areas like Texas, which is where I am. Plus, my outdoor kitchen has heavy exposure to the elements, even though we’re building a cover this time. I’ve seen others that are more like extensions of the house, so those may do better with steel.

It’s pretty easy to design access to the shut off valve with an access door with c-block. It’s actually a requirement in our town, making that a moot point. Steel provides much more flexibility, though, leaving you with more room for storage. Those storage areas will be paneled, leaving you with a much cleaner space inside. We addressed that with “boxed” stainless steel cabinets instead of just access doors.

In the end, after lots of research, the rust risk and personal experience led me to c-block again. Now, if I can only get my contractor to finish the job….

As far as countertop goes, we went with a leathered granite, which will help minimize water spots.

Good luck!

 

[jark87]

No 2 ways about it, cinder block just looks bad when in raw form. Everything is level though and stone facing and granite will follow soon! We’re getting closer!

 

[Liz315]

I didn’t want shinny granite because it felt out of place outside to me so we did a leathered steel grey granite. The leathering gives it texture like a natural stone and a matte appearance so it isn’t high gloss. Love it.

 

[jark87]

I didn’t want shinny granite because it felt out of place outside to me so we did a leathered steel grey granite. The leathering gives it texture like a natural stone and a matte appearance so it isn’t high gloss. Love it.

I’m really glad to hear that. We chose the same granite for our countertops. We’re adding a cover, but it’s small and we expect that rain may still reach the counters. We’re hoping the texture will help eliminate water spots.

Crew is finishing up the cinder block work today. Light at the end of the tunnel - finally!

 

[joshlarsen]

We decided to go with granite as well. Were going with a lighter color but also the leathered texture so its not blinding shiny in the sun and hopefully it will show less spots and what not.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

You might consider sealing the stone surfaces that you have. If you have a test piece of material you can try out a sealer and see if you like the effect. I have been using Tung oil on some wood handles around the home with very promising results. Tung oil can also be used on porous stone surfaces as well. It is a “below the surface” natural oil that hardens over time. It creates a water repellent surface and is easily touched up when needed. Since the granite you have is quite dark, the color change would be entirely in terms of the “shine” added to it. It’s also a naturally derived oil and so it is completely non-toxic. You simply flood apply it to the surface, let it sit and then wipe away the excess with a rag.

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Just to give an idea -

These two butter spreaders have the same wood handle. The one on left was finished with 2 coats of Tung oil. The one on the right is just sanded wood down to 0000 steel wool. The oiled handle is waterproof and has a deeper color but no surface layer. The oil is all “under the surface”.

 

[jark87]

Almost finished! Just need granite, privacy slats in the back, and tongue-in-groove cedar ceiling. No more visible cinder block.

 

[jark87]

Granite installed and sealed. Just need carpentry, final electrical and gas connection to grill. Long project, but worth it in the end, as we’ll have MUCH more counter space and storage, lights and a cover for rain protection.

 

[joshlarsen]

Granite installed and sealed. Just need carpentry, final electrical and gas connection to grill. Long project, but worth it in the end, as we’ll have MUCH more counter space and storage, lights and a cover for rain protection.

View attachment 391259

Looks real nice. Our countertop is suppose to be installed in the next few days then the PB will come and finish the rest.

 

[Texasresident]

Looks real nice. Our countertop is suppose to be installed in the next few days then the PB will come and finish the rest.

What countertop you are getting ..