ASR - Concrete Cancer - Austin, TX

[jftexan]

Has anyone had experience with this issue? Alkali–silica reaction - Wikipedia.

3yr old - fresh water pool with cracks all over the walls
Apparently the Shot Crete company (among others here) had not mixed right and messed up a number of pools.

Edit by Jim R.

thansk

 

[jftexan]

Not looking for legal advice, I'm interested in assessment, remediation of pool (repair) and any procedures you had to follow. I'm sure there's someone on here who like me, paid $100K+ for a pool and then had this happen when you trusted (originally) reputable companies.

 

[Jimrahbe]

jf,

Let's see of @JamesW has heard of this..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[JamesW]

Maybe the plaster is cracked?

You can't see the gunite/shotcrete.

Can you show pictures?

You probably need an expert to determine if the plaster is cracked or the shotcrete.

Who suggested ASR?

Concrete can have many different types of failure.

The only way to really determine if the concrete is good or not is to core drill a sample and have it professionally analyzed.

 

[JamesW]

Concrete Cancer: Alkali Silica Reaction (Part I) - Water Shapes

While concrete is the world’s most used building material, it is comprised of natural elements and can be susceptible to potentially destructive problems. As Paolo Benedetti explains here in the first of a three part-series, Alkali Silica Reaction, (ASR) is among the most common and highest risk...

watershapes.com

Concrete Cancer Part II - Water Shapes

As discussed in Part I, Alkali Silica Reaction (ASR) is a common and potentially devastating “disease” that afflicts concrete. It’s caused by reactions that take place between the alkali compounds in cement and silica in many types of aggregate that grow and spread in the presence of water...

watershapes.com

Concrete Cancer III (a perfect storm) - Water Shapes

As Paolo Benedetti explains in this conclusion to his series on Alkali Silica Reaction, although the problem can be avoided with basic and well-known precautionary measures, it is almost impossible to cure once the problem starts. The business implications are grim for watershapers who are being...

watershapes.com

 

[JamesW]

What plaster did you get?

Contact the plaster manufacturer to see what they say.

Did the pool builder subcontract the gunite/shotcrete?

Are there complaints about ASR for other local pools?

If yes, have the claims been investigated by a qualified professional?

If yes, have you contacted the professional engineer or expert?

What is the ground water situation?

Are there complaints about the builder or the gunite subcontractor?

Have you contacted the builder and the gunite subcontractors to see what they say?

 

[JamesW]

Apparently the Shot Crete company (among others here) had not mixed right and messed up a number of pools.

Can you get a batch report for the concrete mix from the concrete supplier?

When a concrete company orders a batch of concrete, they specify what concrete they want.

The supplier keeps records of the order and the batch report should have the details of the batch including things like psi, slump, admixtures, aggregate, cement, water content etc.

What specifications were specified for the concrete?

Did they do gunite or shotcrete?

Has the pool shifted or become unlevel?

Are tiles or coping coming loose?

What was the weather like during the shell shoot day?

How long between the shell shoot and plaster?

Did you water the shell until plaster was applied?

What was the concrete thickness?

Is the cracking uniform everywhere?

 

[jftexan]

Maybe the plaster is cracked?

You can't see the gunite/shotcrete.

Can you show pictures?

You probably need an expert to determine if the plaster is cracked or the shotcrete.

Who suggested ASR?

Concrete can have many different types of failure.

The only way to really determine if the concrete is good or not is to core drill a sample and have it professionally analyzed.

Yes the plaster has horizontal runner cracks all over, just like the ASR pools (that have been confirmed). I had another pool company evaluate it look at this and they are pretty sure. Of course you have to take a $4K core sample to confirm, which hopefully the insurance company will cover.

Pictures are in the original post - I can get you more if you'd ilke.

This is not Gunite, its Shotcrete, which to my understanding is mixed on site and they shot immediately versus concrete/gunite.

 

[JamesW]

Pictures are in the original post - I can get you more if you'd like.

I don't see any pictures.

 

[jftexan]

Can you get a batch report for the concrete mix from the concrete supplier?

When a concrete company orders a batch of concrete, they specify what concrete they want.

The supplier keeps records of the order and the batch report should have the details of the batch including things like psi, slump, admixtures, aggregate, cement, water content etc.

What specifications were specified for the concrete?

Did they do gunite or shotcrete?

Has the pool shifted or become unlevel?

Are tiles or coping coming loose?

What was the weather like during the shell shoot day?

How long between the shell shoot and plaster?

Did you water the shell until plaster was applied?

What was the concrete thickness?

Is the cracking uniform everywhere?

1. As you can imagine, neither the pool contractor or the shotcrete company are fully cooperating on that information at this time. I have attorney involved.
   Its shotcrete.
2. The pool has not shifted, we are on a pretty good rock base.
3. Some tiles are coming loose on the spa where the cracks formed (likely from water seepage).
4. Perfect the weather when it was shot in a June Texas Summer
5. The shell was shot then the plaster was probably about 6 weeks later - they had to wait on the large rock waterfall to be done
6. Not sure on the thickness, all I have are the pictures (here are some more)
7. Cracking is all the places where water looks like it leaked behind (coping routing, poor tile seals, waterfall, etc)
8. The finish is Quartzscape pebble.

 

[JamesW]

ASR pools (that have been confirmed).

Confirmed by who?

Can you get them to look?

You definitely need a core sample, even if you have to pay and then maybe get reimbursed.

 

[JamesW]

Maybe this person can help.

About Paolo Benedetti | Aquatic Technology Pool & Spa | Creating water as Art | Infinity Pool Design, Construction, Luxury Pools, Custom Color Lighted Spas, Animated Fountains, Aquatic Art, Expert Witness | Located in Morgan Hill, CA Serving Internat

Pool Design, International Swimming Pool Designer, Paolo Benedetti, Aquatic Technology Pool and Spa, The international standard for innovative pool designs with expertise in vanishing edge pools, infinity edge pools, negative edge pools, knife edge pools, hillside pools, rooftop pools...

www.aquatictechnology.com

Qualifications | Aquatic Technology Pool & Spa | Creating water as Art | Infinity Pool Design, Construction, Luxury Pools, Custom Color Lighted Spas, Animated Fountains, Aquatic Art, Expert Witness | Located in Morgan Hill, CA Serving Internationally

Pool Design, International Swimming Pool Designer, Paolo Benedetti, Aquatic Technology Pool and Spa, The international standard for innovative pool designs with expertise in vanishing edge pools, infinity edge pools, negative edge pools, knife edge pools, hillside pools, rooftop pools...

www.aquatictechnology.com

Professional Affiliations | Aquatic Technology Pool & Spa | Creating water as Art | Infinity Pool Design, Construction, Luxury Pools, Custom Color Lighted Spas, Animated Fountains, Aquatic Art, Expert Witness | Located in Morgan Hill, CA Serving Inte

Pool Design, International Swimming Pool Designer, Paolo Benedetti, Aquatic Technology Pool and Spa, The international standard for innovative pool designs with expertise in vanishing edge pools, infinity edge pools, negative edge pools, knife edge pools, hillside pools, rooftop pools...

www.aquatictechnology.com

 

[JamesW]

CONSTRUCTION 1956: Understanding Alkali Silica Reaction (ASR)

March 15th, 2023 - Paolo Benedetti

online.watershape.org

​

Concrete Cancer​

Original Presentation Date: March 15th, 2023

Presented by Paolo Benedetti, IWI

Alkali Silica Reaction (ASR) is often referred to as "Concrete Cancer", an affliction that destroys cementitious structures from within by way of a complex set of runaway chemical reactions.

Builders who do not understand ASR and fail to take preventative measures become exposed to catastrophic project failures.

The good news is that ASR can be reliably prevented by applying basic knowledge and proven methods.

This course defines ASR in layman's terms and covers prevention from both the technical and business perspectives.

1:00 hour -Watershape University is authorized by IACET to offer 0.1 CEUs for this program.

CEUs are awarded for successfully logging completion of this webinar through the course curriculum page after viewing the lecture. Further instructions for registering your completion of this course are posted on the course curriculum page below the webinar recording.

LEARNING OUTCOMES

1. Define Alkali Silica Reaction (ASR), its basic chemistry and effects on concrete structures.
2. Examine symptoms including cracking and gel formation, and how to identify ASR.
3. Explore preventive measures including admixtures, aggregate selection, and waterproofing.
4. Discuss financial and contracting implications, and how to address ASR from a business standpoint.

 

[JamesW]

If you really have multiple confirmed instances of ASR, then Paolo is probably already involved as he is the acknowledged expert.

Contact him to see what he recommends.

Maybe he can help directly or refer you to a local expert.

 

[jftexan]

Just want to post this and say if anyone else is having this issue (typically pools in texas in the last 5 years) feel free to contact me:

Knowledge podcast on the topic

 

[JamesW]

Interesting, thanks for posting.

Are you in the video?

What further information have you found out about your pool?

 

[JamesW]

It seems like the aggregate needs to be quality controlled to prevent the reactive silica from being used.

 

[midlifecrisis]

Thanks for posting this.

 

[JamesW]

 

[jftexan]

I’m still going through the process on my pool. Next is core sample and testing. $4-9k so we will see what the pool co says first.

One of the guys in the video is helping a lot of central texas owners with the issue. I’m not in the video.