Thinking about getting a new Pentair pump

[Sws]

Hello,

I'm thinking about changing my pump. My existing pump is some generic Black and Decker 2 speed 1.5hp that looks like it was built in a Chinese build house that makes store brand stuff. Available speeds are 1720 and 3450 rpm. It has a qmax rating of 92gpm. I imagine that's the max flow at 3450 rpm. Per the label, it pulls 12amps on high speed and 4.8 on low speed. Last year I ran it on high for 7 hours a day. This year I was planning on running it on low for longer period of time.

This year, Ill need it to flow enough for a mastertemp 300 to operate. The flow range on it is 30-120gpm. I have no clue what the existing pump flows on low. Maybe someone here knows.

I plan on using a Pentair IC40 next year. The flow range on that is ~25 to 80 before a bypass is recommended and I didnt build a bypass for where it's going. I could add one though.

Im GUESSING that my pump on low will flow enough for the heater and salt cell. On high, it may be good for the heater, but possibly too much for the salt cell. I won't know until I try it.

Now, Im obsessing over maybe buying a new pump.

Im considering the Pentair Superflo 1.5 or Intelliflo pumps. The 3hp is way overkill for my basic pool, but I see people saying to get the bigger pump and run it low. I also like that it has 2 inch unions since I have 2" plumbing. I feel like a 1.5 is already bigger than I need but I want opinions on that.

I have an intelliconnect which Penair says is compatible with Superflo, Whisperflo and Intelliflo pumps. I only see Intelliflo in the app as an option, but they stated in an email that those 3 pumps can be controlled via rs485. I would need their connector and only us 2 wires on it.

I should also note that I can easily change from 120v to 240v if I need to.

Also, with the new plumbing, I get a whirlpool in my skimmer with the existing pump on high. Its not enough to suck in air, but its clearly visible.

Im leaning towards a superflow 1.5 if I can control the running RPM in the Intelliconnect app.

What are everyone's thoughts?

 

[PoolStored]

If you are going to Pentair VSP, for the few extra bucks, get the intelliflow 3hp.
I have about the same setup with heater. I really want to replace the superflo, but the benefits of the cost of the whole pump don't make sense.
For the $200, it will pay you back in electricity costs of the intelliflow vs. the superflo.
Give me a couple minutes and I'll confirm.

 

[Sws]

If you are going to Pentair VSP, for the few extra bucks, get the intelliflow 3hp.
I have about the same setup with heater. I really want to replace the superflo, but the benefits of the cost of the whole pump don't make sense.
For the $200, it will pay you back in electricity costs of the intelliflow vs. the superflo.
Give me a couple minutes and I'll confirm.

Thanks. I should have mentioned that I have solar and over produce.

I wouldn't save any cash on electric, but using less power is still good. I can use more electric vs gas heat in the winter. It helps on the gas side.

 

[PoolStored]

I ran the numbers, it is a bit cheaper to run the intelliflo. Assume 12 hrs at 20 GPM and 12 hrs at 40 GPM, the intelliflo is cheaper for the year by $14. Payback is 13 years on the upgrade at $200.

There are more benefits to running a large HP VS pump then just economics - less noise, runs cooler, may last longer running at lower RPMs, more headroom for when you want high flow, especially when the pool has a spa and the filter pump is feeding the spa jets, but that may not apply to you...

The payback of a VSP vs. a single speed is no brainer, almost any VSP you get. The payback VSP vs. 2 speed, really depends on how you use the 2 speed.

 

[Newdude]

The VS pump is the most efficient because the 2 set speeds often don't line up where you need them. For example, my SWG kicks on at 700 RPMs, skimming does great at 1200 and I need 2200 to vacuum. I can dial the VS pump to how I need at that time.

But the 2 speed still saves alot of electricity and you won't recover the costs of a new pump over what you already have. If this pump dies (or doesn't do what you need) then you might recover the cost between efficiencies of 2 new pumps that you're looking at.

With your simple plumbing, the 1.5HP on low will probably activate the heaters flow switch. It'll almost certainly turn on the SWG. But you won't know for sure until you try.

There is no too high for the SWG or heater, except for the electric bill from running the pump at full throttle.

Based on the likelihood of it working, I'd give the B&D pump a shot for free. Intelliflos dance around $2k most days.

 

[HermanTX]

Most of us have what is referred to as a “basic pool” regardless of the volume. This includes a filter, a heater and a SWCG.
For the little extra cost to have a Intelliflo 3Hp pump you will save money on lower energy usage adn be able to control the speed and have better options for running the SWCG.

 

[Sws]

Thanks everyone. Ill see if the one I have operates the heater and then go from there.

I got the recommended flow numbers from the Mastertemp and intellichlor manuals. I was concerned with exceeding them but it sounds like a non issue. Is my understanding correct?

 

[Newdude]

I was concerned with exceeding them but it sounds like a non issue. Is my understanding correct

Correct. Pool pumps are designed for pool equipment and vice versa. Don't get hung up between performance claims in a lab with little or no plumbing attached and the high end warnings you will never come close to, even with a 3HP pump.

 

[djdonte]

I just replaced my old single speed 1.5hp with an Intelliflo3 3hp and I really like it. It was spendy, but what did it for me was the ability to control it from my phone, instead of having to play with the schedule on the pump keypad. The wifi app is pretty good and I have the extra relay board to turn on and off my SWG. They relay board will also run a 16amp load. I thought about wiring my waterfall pump to it, but it would be a whole wiring reroute. Even at its lowest setting, it still triggers the SWG flow switch. I have it running at 35% (1200rpm) 24/7 with one hour of full speed a day. Its using less than half the power of my old motor running 8 hours a day.

 

[Jimrahbe]

@djdonte

You forgot how quiet your pump is at 1200 rpm..

You should run your pump any way you want, but I suggest that your run it 24/7.. Your pump will thank you, and your pool will thank you...

I find that I like making a little chlorine all the time, and skimming all the time.. My pool stays cleaner and I believe that it is better for the pump to run 24/7, than it is to be turned on and off each day.. I also like the look of my pool when it is not 'dead'.. Cost to do this in Texas is way less than $20 bucks a month..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[djdonte]

Maybe you misunderstood me or perhaps I wasn't clear. I do indeed have the pump running at 35 percent all day and night, with my SWG on 35 percent. I have it ramp up to full speed one hour each day so my suction cleaner can do its thing, and I get a little extra skimmer action. Once I recover from my pump purchase I plan to buy a robot and ditch the MX-8. Even before the full speed hour, the skimmer still catches most everything that is floating save for what gets caught on the cleaner hose. I am using about 7kwh per day like this.

 

[Jimrahbe]

dj,

Apparently my brain is not working today...

For some reason, I misread your post and thought you were only running 8 hours a day..

My bad,

Jim R.

 

[Sws]

Thanks for the insight everyone.

I was concerned about the 3hp putting me at risk of damaging something, but you've put me at ease.

Ill see how they B&D works for this season and see if I can relieve this itch without buying a new pump right away. The salt cell is probably the smarter purchase for whatever I do next.

 

[Newdude]

The salt cell is probably the smarter purchase for whatever I do next

I dunno. If you're going back and forth to the store lugging jugs all the time, you'll have less bandwidth for agonizing over pumps. So it wouldn't be all bad.

 

[djdonte]

If your pump is still in working order I would invest in the salt cell first. My only regret is not doing it sooner. Lugging bottles of LC all the time sucked.

 

[Sws]

Are you guys hardwiring the 220v pumps straight to the breaker or are you adding a manual disconnect inline?

 

[djdonte]

I believe code requires a disconnect. I just wired it to my Intermatic timer and took off the on/off clips.

 

[Jimrahbe]

S,

In most cases it makes sense to have some kind of disconnect at the equipment pad.. Be it a breaker, disconnect, or automation panel.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Sws]

S,

In most cases it makes sense to have some kind of disconnect at the equipment pad.. Be it a breaker, disconnect, or automation panel.

Thanks,

Jim R.

I have a subpanel right next to it so I can go straight to the breaker. I just didnt know if it needed some other form of physical disconnection.

 

[HermanTX]

I have a subpanel right next to it so I can go straight to the breaker. I just didnt know if it needed some other form of physical disconnection.

I think it is prudent to put in a manual switch between your pump and subpanel if you do not have automation or time clock to manually turn power on or off to a pump. No one should put wet hands into a subpanel to throw a circuit breaker. You have to think about the emergency issue - water is spraying due to leaking pipe or whatever and you need to shut down the pump ASAP. A switch is much easier, safer and quicker.