Spa jet and return question?

[1Mik]

I have a spillover spa with two returns and 6 jets. The jets have eyeballs that have openings that are the same size as my regular pool returns. The two returns though have much narrower (what i would call a jet opening) and water comes out from them pretty forcefully, almost nothing from the jets, but the system isn’t programmed yet. I think this is backwards but don’t know. Foreman says it’s correct Appreciate any info.

 

[ajw22]

Do you have a single pump for your pool and spa or a dedicated second pump for your spa jets?

Post pics of your equipment pad especially around the pool and spa returns. It partly depends how your pool and spa is setup.

 

[1Mik]

Do you have a single pump for your pool and spa or a dedicated second pump for your spa jets?

Post pics of your equipment pad especially around the pool and spa returns. It partly depends how your pool and spa is setup.

Hello, yes, thanks, single pump for pool and spa. Blower integrated into jet lines. Blower and jet lines are 2 inch piping to spa then step down to 1 1/2 inside spa. Jets have same return “eyeballs” is seems as the main pool does. The spa returns (2) are also 2 inches but not stepped down so it looks like they put a larger plate into plaster with some screw on fitting but it is a smaller opening than jets (guessing half inch or so, need to measure). System not programmed yet but when I turn on blower it just shoots air up side of spa wall and blows water out of spa.

 

[ajw22]

What do the labels say on the two pipes on the left?

 

[1Mik]

What do the labels say on the two pipes on the left?

The automated valve label is “pool return” and the one directly left of “spa jets” is “spa return”

 

[ajw22]

Your builders plumber set your returns so that you will not be able to turn your spa spillover on and off automatically using your automation. He should have put the diverter valve with the actuator that is on your POOL RETURN at the T fitting above it.

He has set you up so that your spa spillover will alway run unless you turn valves manually. And the aeration of the water will cause your pH to rise rapidly which will require more frequent acid additions.

As the valves are set right now the POOL RETURNS are closed, the SPA RETURNS are CLOSED, and water is flowing out of the SPA JETS.

Post pics of your spa and show me where the water is comi9ng out of with the valves that way.

The water flow out of the SPA JETS should be strong with the valves set this way. Is it?

 

[Jimrahbe]

Mik,

I agree with Allen..

Not sure what your pool builder was thinking, but the Return valve should be where the "T" is .. The whole point of the return valve is to allow the automation to select either the Pool mode or Spa mode. Your return valve cannot do that.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[1Mik]

Your builders plumber set your returns so that you will not be able to turn your spa spillover on and off automatically using your automation. He should have put the diverter valve with the actuator that is on your POOL RETURN at the T fitting above it.

He has set you up so that your spa spillover will alway run unless you turn valves manually. And the aeration of the water will cause your pH to rise rapidly which will require more frequent acid additions.

As the valves are set right now the POOL RETURNS are closed, the SPA RETURNS are CLOSED, and water is flowing out of the SPA JETS.

Post pics of your spa and show me where the water is comi9ng out of with the valves that way.

The water flow out of the SPA JETS should be strong with the valves set this way. Is it?

Not surprised if they did misplace auto valve, it’s been a continuous line of items to address. It’s not programmed properly yet for pool or spa mode, so I had in this position by overide of valve but flow was out of jets, I don’t remember it being really strong, I’ll check once they program this system. I didn’t have blower on at time. I don’t have a good spa pic at moment, but in this position water was out of higher opening (have 5 others not in pic) the lower opening is one of the 2 returns (which we’re off in this valve arrangement) . Thanks for your input

 

[1Mik]

Mik,

I agree with Allen..

Not sure what your pool builder was thinking, but the Return valve should be where the "T" is .. The whole point of the return valve is to allow the automation to select either the Pool mode or Spa mode. Your return valve cannot do that.

Thanks,

Jim R.

Thanks Jim, since valves aren’t even programmed right now I don’t know how to test. When i go to box, system is currently in service mode, changing to spa mode sends the pool return valve from open in one direction to open in other direction (never stops in middle where pool return would be closed)

 

[1Mik]

Mik,

I agree with Allen..

Not sure what your pool builder was thinking, but the Return valve should be where the "T" is .. The whole point of the return valve is to allow the automation to select either the Pool mode or Spa mode. Your return valve cannot do that.

Thanks,

Jim R.

I thought I was grasping it, but maybe not, i thought spillover spa was supposed to run over to pool continually, unless I put into spa mode where spa main drain would open and pool drain and pool return would close. I would turn on blower with automation, Bluetooth or aqualink I thought.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Mik,

Your problem is not programming, it is the physical location of the Return valve.

Your spa will overflow into the pool, even in the spa mode, which it should not... Unless you manually shut off the spa returns. If your system was built correctly, it would only spillover in the Pool mode and the spillover would automatically shut off in the Spa mode.

You need to get your pool builder to fix the problem by moving Return valve to where the "T" that sends the water to Spa Returns and the Spa jets, is currently located.




Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[ajw22]

You should be running your spa spillover using the SPA RETURNS line that has 2 returns.

Then when you can use your spa in a calm mode with just the SPA RETURNS on or you can turn off the SPA RETURNS and turn on the SPA JETS if you want water from the 6 jets. Your builder really shoudl have given you and automated valve so you could switch between SPA RETURNS and SPA JETS using your automation.

Please create your signature with details of your pool and equipment. For us to help you we need to understand your full pool setup.

What pump do you have? If it is a VS pump what speed is it running?

 

[1Mik]

Thanks yes, i tested it with pool return closed and definitely do not get enough flow through jets with both spa jets and spa return open. With spa return also closed and blower on, it seems to work properly. I’m going to ask pb to automate it more either by moving or adding automatic valve(s) so I can control spa returns/jets. I’ll update signature tonight, pump is a 1.85 variable speed but not programmed yet (too my dismay)so I don’t know the current speed.

 

[ajw22]

Thanks yes, i tested it with pool return closed and definitely do not get enough flow through jets with both spa jets and spa return open.

With your SPA RETURN and SPA JETS open you divide up the water flow into 8 streams. Let's say your pump produces 80 GPM. Each jet will get 10 GPM of water flow and pressure.

If you close the SPA RETURN you then divide up the water flow 6 ways and each jet flows 13.3 GPM. That is 30% more flow out of the jets with just the SPA JETS on.

With spa return also closed and blower on, it seems to work properly.

That is the way it is designed to work.

I’m going to ask pb to automate it more either by moving or adding automatic valve(s) so I can control spa returns/jets.

You want to be able to turn SPA JETS on or off and when SPA JETS is not on then SPA RETURNs is on. There is no reason for you to need both on at the same time.

I’ll update signature tonight, pump is a 1.85 variable speed but not programmed yet (too my dismay)so I don’t know the current speed.

If your pump is not running at max speed then you can't judge if the spa jets can give you what you expect.

 

[1Mik]

With your SPA RETURN and SPA JETS open you divide up the water flow into 8 streams. Let's say your pump produces 80 GPM. Each jet will get 10 GPM of water flow and pressure.

If you close the SPA RETURN you then divide up the water flow 6 ways and each jet flows 13.3 GPM. That is 30% more flow out of the jets with just the SPA JETS on.




That is the way it is designed to work.



You want to be able to turn SPA JETS on or off and when SPA JETS is not on then SPA RETURNs is on. There is no reason for you to need both on at the same time.



If your pump is not running at max speed then you can't judge if the spa jets can give you what you expect.

Thanks, probably silly question but do people with spillover spas typically run max speed when in spa mode?

 

[ajw22]

Thanks, probably silly question but do people with spillover spas typically run max speed when in spa mode?

In SPA MODE your spillover should not be spilling over. The valves should be set so the pump pulls suction from the spa and returns to the spa.

In SPILLOVER MODE the pump pulls suction from the pool and returns water to the spa returns.

In POOL MODE the pump pulls water from the pool skimmers and returns water to the pool returns.

The speed you run your pump in spa mode with water coming out of your spa jets depends on the pressure you want out of the spa jets.

I have a dedicated spa jet pump in my spa. When in spa mode the main filter/pump circulates water through two spa returns to give the spa filtered and heated water. Then I have a separate spa jet pump with it's own suction ports in the spa that can be turned on to give water out of 8 spa jets.

 

[1Mik]

In SPA MODE your spillover should not be spilling over. The valves should be set so the pump pulls suction from the spa and returns to the spa.

In SPILLOVER MODE the pump pulls suction from the pool and returns water to the spa returns.

In POOL MODE the pump pulls water from the pool skimmers and returns water to the pool returns.

The speed you run your pump in spa mode with water coming out of your spa jets depends on the pressure you want out of the spa jets.

I have a dedicated spa jet pump in my spa. When in spa mode the main filter/pump circulates water through two spa returns to give the spa filtered and heated water. Then I have a separate spa jet pump with it's own suction ports in the spa that can be turned on to give water out of 8 spa jets.

Progress , spoke to builder and he had plumber reroute for automation, works much better now and spa mode works now. I don’t know what speed it was at for the past few days (think it was 1750, so about half max, but I’m able to set pump speed now. Not sure what speed/#days recommended for removing plaster dust but that is a different thread I guess.

 

[ajw22]

Progress , spoke to builder and he had plumber reroute for automation, works much better now and spa mode works now.

Looks much better.

I don’t know what speed it was at for the past few days (think it was 1750, so about half max, but I’m able to set pump speed now. Not sure what speed/#days recommended for removing plaster dust but that is a different thread I guess.

Keep the discussion going here.

What pump do you have?

It helps us to know what equipment you have. Please create your signature with details of your pool and equipment.

How long has water been in your pool?

How often have you been brushing the pool?

 

[1Mik]

I think I got my signature updated properly now, but it’s a jandy 1.85 vsp. Water finished filling early on 16th and pump was started mid 17th (think around 1750rpm), I’ve been brushing twice a day only after pump started, and pool company has been by about 3 times to add chemicals/brush and clean/empty filters. I got aqualink programmed last night and I put speed to 2750 while learning aqualink, then left it at 2400.

 

[ajw22]

That speed is fine. Your HP will determine the minimum flow rate that you can run. It is probably around 1750-2000 rpm.

Is SPILLOVER mode turned on with dipswitch #3 on?