Removal and installation of inserts for handrail

[JohnGn]

Long story short, the inserts for our old handrail were concreted into place incorrectly, which prevented the removal of the handrail completely. So, we had to literally cut the old handrail off at the surface so we could have a mesh winter cover fitted and installed. Now, we'd like to install a new handrail the right way so we can remove it every winter. My question to the forum is: What would the basic steps be for this procedure? I assume we would need to core out the old inserts and a small amount of concrete around the inserts, then place new concrete and embed new inserts. I'm not 100% sure that I am comfortable doing this kind of thing myself, although I could at least core out the concrete because I have a good hammer drill and can just go buy a suitable core bit. Is this kind of project relatively easy? Should I hire a pro? I have to assume that a special pool construction company would likely charge a premium, but it would definitely be done right. Any suggestions? Thanks!

 

[Mdragger88]

@jimmythegreek ??

 

[Pool_Medic]

Core drill, then reinsert new anchors with fresh cement.

 

[avspin]

Also may need to be bonded if metal. Depending how far from the original anchors it may be hard to get to the bonding wire without ripping up concrete. If you're not using metal, never mind.

 

[jimmythegreek]

The anchors are embedded into the deck amd use the deck for support. You cant just core them out or in on a newer pool, they are bonded by a wire underneath.
I dont understand how you had a handrail installed if the spacing was wrong. If it went in it can come out again guaranteed. Post a pic of what your dealing with. What's the spacing between cups?

 

[JohnGn]

Thank you all for your replies. I tried to make the OP short and sweet, and it was light on details for that reason. Here are the details of why I need to cut out the anchors in the first place.

The previous pool owner had a handrail installed using anchors in the concrete deck when they built the pool. Several years later, a large portion of the concrete decking had either failed or looked like Crud, and the owner contracted with a concrete company to come in and replace the decking that had failed. What they new contractor did was a.) fail to pull the handrail out prior to pouring the new decking, and b.) concreted up and over the anchors completely so the handrail could never be removed again. It thus became a permanent handrail, and was completely not removable.

When we bought the house, we wanted to install a safety cover, but the handrail was the kind that "dipped" below the level of the deck at least a foot, down into the water, actually. This meant that the safety cover would have to be "custom made" to accommodate the permanent handrail. And, since the handrail was always submerged at least partially in the pool water, it would eventually corrode and need to be replaced anyway sometime in the future.

We decided to simply cut the handrail off at the surface, with the plan to replace the handrail at some point in the future so it can be removed every winter like a normal handrail. And that's where we are today.

My post was to see if there were any pearls of wisdom y'all could throw at me to make this easier, and it seems that I just need to possibly cut out the area around the anchors to remove both the anchors and bonding wire, and reinstall new anchors, bonding wire and concrete, and buy a new handrail that will be removable. That's all pretty sound logic. Thanks!

 

[jimmythegreek]

If it's an older pool it may not have a bond wire, amd if it did I doubt the concrete guys would care to re attach if they replaced the cups. Gonna need to be creative amd make a large patch look good amd chip it all out amd see what you have left. For reference under pavers I use an 24x30 by 10" deep footing for handrail cups, and 18x24x10 for ladder cups. A 300 pound human leaning on a handrail will exert alot of leverage

 

[avspin]

I used a Saftron Rail and paired it with EZ Anchors. No bonding required as they are not metal. Rented a core drill.

EZ Anchor Socket (Groutless)

EZ Anchor Sockets - Groutless to install standard 1.90" diameter pool rails and ladders without grout. * Non-Corroding * No Grout Required *

www.innovativepoolproducts.com

2018-05-11 13.17.20s.jpg

 

[JamesW]

If you use Saftron rails, you don't need a bond wire.

SĀFTRON polymer rails are non-conductive. When used with SĀFTRON anchor sockets and bases, or installed directly into the deck, no grounding/bonding is required.

SĀFTRON has been tested to be non-conductive by STR Laboratories. The current NEC code shows that SĀFTRON pool rails do not need to be grounded or bonded as the rails are sealed at the time of manufacturing. We have also received a letter form NFPA (NEC Codes) stating that they feel SĀFTRON pool rails are not required to be grounded or bonded.

https://www.saftron.com/faq/pool.html

 

[jimmythegreek]

Saffron are great for add ons, I didn't mention them because he has anchors with cut off pipe he has to deal with too so ues gotta hide that mess

 

[JamesW]

Saffron are great for add ons,

Also good for risottos, pilafs, and paellas.