Pump/Motor help

[Brett S]

So this isn’t actually my pool pump, but rather a pump for my shallow well. Someone told me that it was very similar to a pool pump, so I’m hoping that someone here might be able to help me. I know very little about the pump as it came with the house when I bought it 6 years ago, so the pump is at least 6 years old and probably a good bit older than that.

However, the motor (or something) seems to be failing. When the pump is turned on it doesn’t spin and the motor just hums/buzzes. This actually happened a little less than a year ago and I had someone come out and he said that he replaced the starter capacitor and tried to spin the shaft to make sure it was free and that fixed it at the time. But now it seems to have the same problem. I tried replacing the starter capacitor again, but that didn’t make a difference this time. I’m not sure what he did to try to turn the shaft though, so I didn’t try that.

So at this point I’m not sure what the best option is. I’m not sure if there’s anything I can do to get it working again or if I can just replace the motor or if I would be better off replacing the whole pump. It’s also worth noting that the pump has leaked for pretty much the entire 6 years that I’ve had it. When the pump runs water drips out of the bottom where the metal band goes around it. Since it only runs for a couple of hours a couple of times a week I’ve just never really worried about the leak.

As you can see below, the label has completely faded from the sun, so I really don’t know what brand this is or much of anything about it. I looked very closely at the label and believe that I can make out that it was a 2HP motor and I know that it runs on 220V, so I guess that’s something.

Thanks for any suggestions

 

[cowboycasey]

Is this for sprinklers? The leaking is what has killed the pump, the bearing are shot and the pump will no longer work... You "may" be able to take it apart and replace the bearing but leaking for 6 years I bet it will not even come apart..

Here is a new one that should work great..

Star HSP20P1 2 HP Self Priming Lawn Sprinkler Irrigation Pump, Rugged Cast Iron, Made in the USA using a Majority of US Content - Lawn Sprinkler Pumps - Amazon.com

Star HSP20P1 2 HP Self Priming Lawn Sprinkler Irrigation Pump, Rugged Cast Iron, Made in the USA using a Majority of US Content - Lawn Sprinkler Pumps - Amazon.com

smile.amazon.com

 

[JamesW]

Looks like a Pentair brand. Maybe Sta-Rite or Flotech.

Can you show the entire wiring compartment?

 

[Brett S]

Looks like a Pentair brand. Maybe Sta-Rite or Flotech.

I didn’t see it until I knew what to look for, but I can barely make out “Flotech” on one of the labels

Can you show the entire wiring compartment?

Here you go, which reminds me. I noticed that when I tried to change the starter capacitor that it was only a 110V capacitor. That seemed a bit odd since it’s a 220V motor. I thought that maybe the guy who replaced it a year ago used the wrong one, but when I was looking at 220V capacitors they all looked much bigger and I don’t think they would fit. Is it normal/correct for the 220V motor to have a 110V capacitor?

 

[Brett S]

Is this for sprinklers? The leaking is what has killed the pump, the bearing are shot and the pump will no longer work... You "may" be able to take it apart and replace the bearing but leaking for 6 years I bet it will not even come apart..

Here is a new one that should work great..

Star HSP20P1 2 HP Self Priming Lawn Sprinkler Irrigation Pump, Rugged Cast Iron, Made in the USA using a Majority of US Content - Lawn Sprinkler Pumps - Amazon.com

Star HSP20P1 2 HP Self Priming Lawn Sprinkler Irrigation Pump, Rugged Cast Iron, Made in the USA using a Majority of US Content - Lawn Sprinkler Pumps - Amazon.com

smile.amazon.com

Yes, it is for sprinklers. Thanks for the link. I’d rather not spend $370 if I don’t have to, but I’m really not sure how much life this pump has left and I’d hate to spend a lot of time and effort trying to repair it only to see it fail again in a few months.

 

[JamesW]

If you remove the capacitor, you should be able to slip a 7/16” (11 mm) open end wrench onto a notch on the shaft and turn the shaft clockwise to see if it is frozen.

If you can’t get it to spin like that, you might have to remove the band clamp and spin the impeller clockwise.

Note that there is a loose wire that can get snagged by the centrifugal switch when it spins. The wires need to be tucked in between the stands that hold the capacitor.

When the centrifugal switch spins, the weights swing out and can catch any wires near the weights.

 

[JamesW]

Is it normal/correct for the 220V motor to have a 110V capacitor?

A 240 motor is usually (2) 120 volt windings in series.

The capacitor is in parallel with only one set of windings, so the capacitor only gets 120 volts.

 

[Newdude]

Hey Brett !! When the capacitor failed in my irrigation pump I couldn’t find a replacement. (Same symptoms... humming without running). The only one online was from China and had issues with customs on top of an exorbitant shipping cost. The local plumbing supply places said it was an electrical part and the local electric supply places said it was plumbing

I live amid many farms and wineries and it should have been easily available. Finally somebody suggested the HVAC supply place because central AC units use them also. They had one very close but still not exact. The employee said that +\- 5% was within tolerance for the farrads. I took what he offered and it worked.

for about $12 I’d start there and see if it runs (while still leaking).

 

[Brett S]

If you remove the capacitor, you should be able to slip a 7/16” (11 mm) open end wrench onto a notch on the shaft and turn the shaft clockwise to see if it is frozen.

If you can’t get it to spin like that, you might have to remove the band clamp and spin the impeller clockwise.

OK, So I did that. It took quite a lot of effort to get the shaft to spin, but after a bit I was able to get it to turn reasonably easily by hand (with the wrench). It certainly doesn’t feel like it spins freely, but it doesn’t take a crazy amount of effort to turn it with the wrench now. It does sound like it’s kind of grinding and scraping a little as it turns though.

Unfortunately, however, that didn’t seem to help. It still just hums/buzzes when I try to turn it on.

Note that there is a loose wire that can get snagged by the centrifugal switch when it spins. The wires need to be tucked in between the stands that hold the capacitor.

When the centrifugal switch spins, the weights swing out and can catch any wires near the weights.

Thanks for pointing that out. I was able to route it correctly. Although at this point the motor doesn’t spin anyway

So I guess now the question is... Is it worth trying to replace the seals and bearings and such or am I better off just replacing the pump entirely?

 

[Brett S]

Hey Brett !! When the capacitor failed in my irrigation pump I couldn’t find a replacement. (Same symptoms... humming without running). The only one online was from China and had issues with customs on top of an exorbitant shipping cost. The local plumbing supply places said it was an electrical part and the local electric supply places said it was plumbing

I live amid many farms and wineries and it should have been easily available. Finally somebody suggested the HVAC supply place because central AC units use them also. They had one very close but still not exact. The employee said that +\- 5% was within tolerance for the farrads. I took what he offered and it worked.

for about $12 I’d start there and see if it runs (while still leaking).

Thanks, I was able to get a capacitor from amazon that matched the one that was in there, but unfortunately replacing the capacitor didn’t make a difference. I used the capacitance setting on my multimeter to test them and both the old and new ones did appear to be in range.

 

[Newdude]

So I guess now the question is... Is it worth trying to replace the seals and bearings and such or am I better off just replacing the pump entirely

That is a question with many answers, and depending on how you look at it.... they are all right.

If time wasted and longevity is the highest priority, I’d replace the whole shebang.

if the budget is the bigger factor, I’d rebuild it and hope for the best. If I rebuilt it and it failed soon after, I’d be happier buying a new one knowing that i tried and it was now dead-dead.

 

[JamesW]

It looks like a lot of corrosion.

You will probably need to remove the band clamp and see if the impeller will spin freely.

Are you sure that the motor is 240 volts?

The wires are black and white, which usually means 120 volts.

Does the label say 115 volts or 230 volts or 115/230 volts?

Did you verify the voltage with a multimeter?

 

[JamesW]

Is it worth trying to replace the seals and bearings and such or am I better off just replacing the pump entirely?

I would not replace bearings.

You can probably do a new motor and seals and that will probably be ok.

Can you read the motor label well enough to get the right replacement?

 

[Brett S]

It looks like a lot of corrosion.

You will probably need to remove the band clamp and see if the impeller will spin freely.

Is that just a matter of loosening the screw that’s attaching the clamp and removing it and pulling the pump apart?

Are you sure that the motor is 240 volts?

The wires are black and white, which usually means 120 volts.

Does the label say 115 volts or 230 volts or 115/230 volts?

Did you verify the voltage with a multimeter?

I’m 100% positive that it’s 240V. The other end of the wires are connected to both legs of a 240V circuit breaker. I’m not sure who wired it originally, but for some reason they used black/white.

 

[Brett S]

I would not replace bearings.

You can probably do a new motor and seals and that will probably be ok.

Can you read the motor label well enough to get the right replacement?

What exactly do I need to look for on the label? It’s pretty difficult to read and there is a lot of writing. I did see that it’s a 2HP motor. Is there more that I would need to try to find on the label?

 

[JamesW]

Is that just a matter of loosening the screw that’s attaching the clamp and removing it and pulling the pump apart?

Yes, that should work.

It should be similar to these pumps.

What exactly do I need to look for on the label?

Voltage, horsepower, service factor, frame.

 

[Brett S]

OK, got the band and the volute off. (Found an ant colony living under the band, so that was interesting). It’s a bit of a rusty mess in there. I can’t seem to rotate the impeller a full 360 degrees. It seems to be free for about 270 degrees, but then it binds up.

 

[JamesW]

I would finish disassembling it to see if it's worth replacing just the motor or the whole pump.
Did you find the motor information?

Look for any part numbers anywhere and that will help identify the exact pump model number.

 

[JamesW]

Note that you have to remove the impeller before removing the seal plate.

The impeller might have a reverse thread screw in the center that you have to remove (clockwise) before removing the impeller.

 

[Brett S]

I think I’m just going to wind up replacing the whole thing. It means a little plumbing work, since there were no unions or anything used, but at least then I don’t need to worry about trying to figure out the correct seal kit or motor mount and I know that everything is new and functional.

I found what I think is the same pump at Lowes for $289:

https://www.lowes.com/pd/Flotec-Spinkler-Lawn-Pump-2-HP-Thermoplastic-Lawn-Pump/999911313

I also found this Everbilt pump at Home Depot for the same price:

Everbilt 2 HP Plastic Lawn Sprinkler Pump EFLS20-HD - The Home Depot

www.homedepot.com

The advantage to the Home Depot one is that it’s in stock at my local store. The Lowes one would have to be a special order that wouldn’t arrive until Tuesday.

Either way, for $289 I’m not sure I’d be paying a lot more than I would for just a motor and at least then everything would be new.

Do you have any thoughts about Flotec vs Everbilt?