Pool Electric subpanel fed from main service box?

[frank411]

Does anyone else have their pool equipment subpanel box right next to the whole house electric box and fed directly from there?

I was getting quotes to add a heat pump to my pool and an electrician said this was a major code violation. That he would have to run from the main breaker inside the house back outside again and it would cost $3000!!! This seems excessive, but even without the cost I want it to make sure this is safe!

 

[Jimrahbe]

Frank,

Let's see if we can get someone that knows codes to respond..

That said, that does not appear to me to be your main breaker panel, but rather where the power comes into the building and the box with the meter... Most sub panels are feed from a circuit breaker in your main Circuit breaker panel, normally inside the house somewhere.. Does not look right to me...

Calling Allen @ajw22

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[ajw22]

Interesting situation. There are lots of creative electricians out there. I think this is why the NEC is so complex to try and reign in the creativity. Part of the NEC is to make electrical wiring standard and predictable so that an electrician can work on it and not find some prior electrician left some traps that can hurt or kill him.

To fully understand what is going on we need to see the wiring in the main house panel. Some of the things the NEC requires is a Main Disconnect for all power to a residence, neutral and ground being bonded together only at the service panel and not at subpanels.

It looks like the black GE breaker next to the meter is the main disconnect for the house. You can see the neutral and grounds bonded together to the left of the disconnect. It looks like the hots come in to the top of the disconnect. The wires out the bottom probably feed the panel in the house. That effectively makes the breaker panel in the house a sub-panel.

There are then taps that were clamped onto the house hot wires to pickoff power for the pool sub-panel. This may be where part of the issue is. Those taps may be sufficient to handle 40 amps for the two breakers. Those taps and the wiring to the pool sub-panel are not adequate to add 50 amps for the heat pump.

Usually the feed from a main panel to a subpanel has a breaker in the main panel that protects the wiring running to the sub-panel. Then if the sub-panel has more then 6 circuits it needs a disconnect in the panel. If 6 or less circuits then the breaker in the main panel is sufficient. There is no breaker protecting the wiring from those taps to the sub-panel. That is a code violation I think.

The hot lines into the pool sub-panel do not connect to the two hot bus screws at the top of the bus bars on the breaker panel. Instead they are run through a breaker to power the bus bars. That is reverse of the normal feed. And there is that hand written warning that those lines are hot. That is a booby trap for an unwary electrician if that front panel was ever lost and the warning lost. The way the sub-panel feed is wired has code violations.

Bottom line, that pool sub-panel has code issues. An electrician can't safely pickoff 100 amps from the existing pickoff connections. The proper way is to wire using the proper size wire from the main panel with a CB in the main panel feeding the sub panel. I see why the electrician said what he did.

 

[Jimrahbe]

Thanks Allen,

Jim R.