ICF 20'x40' Owner Built

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N

natetanr

Active member
Dec 10, 2021
33
Farmington / Utah
Pool Size
38100
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Im a serious DIYer and I'm in the planning phase of building a 20'x40' 20x44 icf pool with autocover and SWCG. Going from 4' to 8' 3.5' to 8.5' depth with diving board. Trying to keep budget around 50k. Probably closer to 65k now at a minimum. Rebar and concrete are more expensive then I thought.

A couple years ago I built a 30x35 natural swimming pool / pond with upflow bog filter but its been tough to keep the string algae at bay and the wife would prefer a pool.

Design
Working with Pool and Spa Designs out of Scottsdale to help with some of the plans and parts lists and possible wholesale discounts although I have a wholesale contractor connection already.

Why ICF
I'm going with ICF for a few reasons: its DIY'able, insulation is a bonus, I can use my existing pond hole and not worry about it being overdug on the sides. I've poured lots of concrete over the years including flatwork and foundations. Planning on a monolithic pour using fab-form products. See icfguru.com and some of there builds. Challenge is the city requires stamped engineering and I'm struggling to find an engineer willing to help with an ICF pool.

Utilities
I already have a sub panel and power run for my pond so electric is ready to go but would need a long gas run if I want a NG Pool heater.

Heat
I'm thinking a pentair cool / heat pump will be the best route as it will save on utilities and the cost of running a gas line from the meter. (I already have a Pentair VSP). Not sure how effective a heat pump is though in Northern Utah. Summers get hot and the cooling feature would be nice lots of people in the area struggle to keep there pool cool in the summer. I realize i may not be able to heat much in the early spring and late fall. Autocover should help keep the heat in. Going with a gas heating for now.

Finish
I'm still contemplating the finish, likely will go with vinyl but I'm concerned about kids putting a hole in it. I will want to put something over the ICF to prevent denting like a base coat. I may splurge and go for plaster or pebbletec. If I go with a liner I think I will have budget for a separate spa.

Filter
I'm thinking a large cartridge filter will work best for me. I'm not sure what to do with salty back flow water if I were cleaning a sand filter and being able to use the hose to clean off the cartridge filter seams simple.

Other ideas
I plan on using a channel drain to reduce robot cleaner getting stuck on the drain.

Next Steps
Find someone willing to do the engineering (waiting on quotes) Engineering stamped and in hand
Get ICF and Fab-form materials Done
Get building permit from the city (summitted permit)
Drain pond and remove liner done
Decide on finish (pebblesheen if budget allows)
order equipment (autocover, diving board,)
Purchase pvc pipe
Purchase rebar
Excavate hole for pool Done
Geotech inspection Done
Deliver gravel for base of concrete (ordered arriving 6/17, they will have a "rock shooter" to spread the rock out)
Install floor insulation
Form up ICF
Brace ICF
Stub plumbing in ICF
Form equipment pad
Pour concrete
Gas line to equipment pad
Electric line to equipment pad
Trench for plumbing

Equipment (updated based on suggestions)
Pump - Pentair 011018 IntelliFlo 3hp VSP (own)
SWCG and Automation - intellicenter w/ Pentair IC60 (purchased)
Filter - Pentair EC-160332 Clean and Clear Plus 520 Cartridge (purchased)
Heater - Pentair 400K BTU (purchased)
Lights - Pentair MicroBrite's x 4 (purchased)
 
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What a project! I had to go look up what ICF was. I hadn't heard of insulating concrete forms. Of course, I am not a DIY'er for a project that big.

Have you checked with your pool design firm to determine if the engineer they normally work with will do your engineering? I did an owner build here in Las Vegas, and the pool architect/designer had an engineer that plugged in my dimensions for my specific area and I got stamped drawings.

About your equipment: Go big! For the filter price out the 520 sq ft rather than the 420 sq ft. You'll want to at minimum, go 2x the pool volume for your SWG, move up to the IC60.

You're on your way. Good luck.
 
Welcome to TFP.

Your equipment list looks good although I am not sure how effective a heat pump will be in your environment and I agree you should get the largest filter you can.

What will be the depth profile?

You might want to browse through prior threads on ICF pools...

Google search results

www.troublefreepool.com www.troublefreepool.com

Please keep us updated with lots of pics as your build goes forward.
 
I spent the weekend draining the pond, digging up the helix skimmer, moving rocks off the liner, finding a new home for the koi and pressure washed the liner in hopes of selling it on the local classifieds or reusing it in the future. Kids were sad to say goodbye to the koi and also see the pond drain. Still trying to find an engineer for the icf steel, the reference i got from the pool designer passed on the job and so did a number of other pool engineers that I reached out to. I'll have to fill in some of the deep end with gravel. Got the gas guy measurements for a quote, still undecided on a heat pump vs gas. Also need help figuring out where to put the equipment pad. I have a sub panel at the pavilion and 220 stubbed by the edge of the pond but thinking about a big ugly stack of equipment and pipes out in the open doesnt sound great. Thinking I might just rerun electrical and put my equipment pad next to the house on the top right side in the planting area?
 

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Nate, I’m also planning on DIYing a pool. Still deciding on ICF or concrete lintel blocks. I’ve built one with lintels before but I really like the light weight foam blocks…easier on my back. I wanted to let you know I saw a while ago one of the ICF companies (Fox Blocks or maybe Build Blocks) websites had a pool section and talked about designing drawing stamped prints for your pool. I’ll update with another post if I find the specifics.
I’ve got a question for anybody. Do ICF pools stay hotter in the summer than other pools? I’m curious if my pool will become a hot bath when it gets hot out and not cool down at night. Any thoughts. We live in North Carolina. Summer temps are mid 90s-day and 80-night.
 
Found a couple leads on engineering, waiting for quotes. Tractor with backhoe is taking forever and has its limits so I'm going to rent an excavator and hope to finish the dig tommorow as I have the geotech soil survey Monday. Place an order for an intelicenter w/salt cell I found on ebay that was a great deal but then they canceled my order and now relisted without the salt cell. Looking now at a DIY option with the Nixie DIY Standalone Nixie Pool Controller · tagyoureit/nodejs-poolController Wiki pretty excited about that but need to find a salt generator in stock.
 

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Not sure how your engineer leads are working out. I found PSE Engineering consultants. www.structure1.com
Looks like they specialize in ICF engineering, or at least are familiar with it.

I looked into the Nixie system. Sounds pretty sweet, not all that sure I want to add another sub-project to the project I liked all the versatility of the system. I might go non-automated at first with the intent to raspberry pi automate down the road.

Also, I’m not sure if you ordered the foam blocks yet but I came across “The Perfect Block”. It’s an ICCF (composite) and looks like a lot less bracing is required prior to pumping concrete. And less possibility of walls swaying during the pump. https://theperfectblock.com/
 
Jaksha said:
Not sure how your engineer leads are working out. I found PSE Engineering consultants. www.structure1.com
Looks like they specialize in ICF engineering, or at least are familiar with it.

I looked into the Nixie system. Sounds pretty sweet, not all that sure I want to add another sub-project to the project I liked all the versatility of the system. I might go non-automated at first with the intent to raspberry pi automate down the road.

Also, I’m not sure if you ordered the foam blocks yet but I came across “The Perfect Block”. It’s an ICCF (composite) and looks like a lot less bracing is required prior to pumping concrete. And less possibility of walls swaying during the pump. https://theperfectblock.com/
Click to expand...
@Jaksha yeah I dont need another project right now will see how much time between stages I have. Ill probably go manual for a while as well and add automation later. I'll be lucky to get the pool in before summer is over. My block should be arriving today I went with Nudura 8", The fab-form materials for the monopour should be arriving today as well. I learned from my neighbor whos doing an addition that concrete is very difficult to get now. He's been calling in every morning at 6am to be put on a waiting list for concrete. They told him it will likely be another 4 weeks before he has a shot.

I have two engineers who said they could help, waiting on quotes.

Progress over the weekend on the excavation was limited. I called Home Depot on Friday and they had there largest mini Ex available. I told them I was on my way and when I arrived 15 minutes later someone was hooked up to it and pulling out. I spent all Saturday on my little B series Kubota with backhoe trying to excavate. Had to make a ramp to get the dirt out. Got down about 5 ft across the entire 20x40. Had the geotech scheduled for today but will have to delay another week until I complete the excavation. Will try again for an excavator as the deep end is going to be near impossible with the tractor.
 

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Equipment
Yesterday I picked up 4 white microbrites, 400k btu heater and the 520 cartridge filter. I rented an excavator for the weekend and also have the diy automation parts on there way (I know a project inside a project) but thats what makes me happy. Instead of the intellicenter I'll be using the rasbbery pi and a bunch of other electronics to automate the system.

Pool length for a diving board
Having thoughts about making my pool longer then 40' after the pool design company told me the specs I gave them are not safe for the diving envelope which was 10' length of 8' depth at the deep end and 16' length of 4' depth at the shallow with transition between. I was going off the dig sheets from pool warehouse for a diving pool but the designer thinks this is too dangerous. I need to shorten the shallow depth or I need a longer pool. The concern is the added cost and if I will have enough block. I like the idea of a larger shallow area for the kids to play in the sloping section in vinyl will be slippery.

What are your thoughts on pool dimensions deep end vs shallow end? Attached is the draft plan showing dimmensions and placement. Do you find most people stick to the shallow end? Will I regret having a shorter shallow end?

Based on my calculations 10’ of pool at 8’ depth and then a 12’ length of slope up to 4’ depth meets the standards?
 

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Spent the weekend with a rented mini ex. We got a massive storm which was really needed as we are in severe drought but the mini ex really bogged down in the thick mud. Water also started filling my hole. Also found on the local classifieds an old easytouch for $200. I figure I would spend that much for the cost of the box and breakers so I purchased it. While not as nice as the intellicenter I plan to use the nodeJSPool controller running on a Pi for wireless automation. Just got my soil survey done today and passed to the engineer. Lots of hand shoveling remains to get out the loose soil and I have a trash pump drawing the water down at the deep end.
excavation.jpg
 
Finished the excavation, found an excavator that finished it up for the same price it would cost me just to rent and deliver the mini ex. Gravel is a week out and then I can start forming icf. So happy to get past this stage. Ground water is still filling it fast. Hopefully I dont get any cave ins.
 

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