Electrical bonding - Splicing to existing green #8 jumper bond and other bonding questions

[tonytoothdoc]

I have 3 parts to my question concerning bonding:

1. Previous owner cut the existing #8 green bonding jumper that is attached to a lug inside the wet light niche and covered with potting compound. There is 8” dangling into the wet niche. Can I use butt connectors with shrink insulation (which is claimed to be waterproof) to attach this to the #8 I run through conduit to bond the niche to a green screw-down lug inside the Hayward box containing the 12 volt transformer?

2. I am replacing the Hayward 2 conductor 12v light with a Florida sun seeker 12gauge 2 conductor w/ insulated ground 12v light. Regarding the ground wire for the light, am I correct in connecting it to only the ground wire from the transformer as well as the incoming ground wire from the electric panel? The prior owner at some point had added a wire from a green screw from the Hayward box to the wire connector housing the incoming ground from the electrical panel, which I think should be removed. My thinking is that I should remove this since I will also have the bonding jumper from the niche tied to one of the screws to the Hayward box? I’m thinking that if I have a bonding wire to the Hayward box from the niche and a wire tying the box back to the ground bar of the panel, if current accidentally travelled from the panel through the ground, it could enter the pool water via the Hayward box then the #8 bonding jumper into the niche. Should the only wire attached to the Hayward box then be the #8 bonding jumper?

3. I used an ohmmeter and got continuity from the bonding jumper from the niche with the isolated electrical ground wire coming from the panel. Is this correct? Is the bonding grid through rebar, other metal parts, etc. tied somewhere to the grounding bar at the electrical panel?

 

[ajw22]

Copper lugs and split bolts are used to connect bonding wires together.

 

[ajw22]

See page 5 lower left diagram in https://hayward.com/media/akeneo_connector/asset_files/0/9/092498_RevA_7587.pdf showing bonding and grounding wires going to the same bus bar.

 

[tonytoothdoc]

Copper lugs and split bolts are used to connect bonding wires together.

Thank you, do these then need to be covered with potting compound to prevent corrosion within the wet niche?

 

[JamesW]

Florida sun seeker 12gauge 2 conductor w/ insulated ground 12v light.

Pool lights need to be "Listed" and low voltage lights should be listed as ok to use without a ground.

UL Listing required?

When replacing a light fixture that is in a wet niche, is the new fixture required to be UL Listed? I'm considering a fixture from sunseeker, but it is not UL. I would really like to go with the SS fixture, but don't want to do something wrong.

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[JamesW]

The requirement is that the light be “Listed”, but not necessarily “UL Listed”.

Listed means certified for use in pools or spas by a qualified testing laboratory.

The accepted standard is UL676.

So, any qualified testing laboratory should make sure that the lights at least meet that standard.

So, it’s a bit confusing since the standard is a UL created standard but the test can be carried out by any “qualified” testing laboratory.

If the light is sold for pool or spa use, it should be listed by a qualified testing laboratory and the manufacturer should specify which testing laboratory has certified the light.

 

[tonytoothdoc]

While replacing a 2 -wire pool light with a 2 -wire w/ground pool light, I noticed that the green #8 wire which was attached to the inside lug of the non-metallic wet niche and covered with potting compound had been cut to about a 6” length by the prior owner (I’m assuming when he had installed the Colorlogic light I’m replacing). Can I attach the #8 green wire I’ve run from the poolside box housing the new transformer through pvc conduit to this “tag” of the bonding jumper. If so, how do I make the connection and , if not, how do I attach the wire I’ve run to the niche since the lug is covered with hardened potting compound?

 

[ajw22]

Didn’t we cover that in this thread of yours?

Electrical bonding - Splicing to existing green #8 jumper bond and other bonding questions

I have 3 parts to my question concerning bonding: 1. Previous owner cut the existing #8 green bonding jumper that is attached to a lug inside the wet light niche and covered with potting compound. There is 8” dangling into the wet niche. Can I use butt connectors with shrink insulation (which...

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[tonytoothdoc]

It appears that my Hayward poolside box housing the transformer has no external lug for attaching the #8 green wire running through pvc from the wet niche. It has multiple green grounding screws and one lug-like elongated piece under a screw which would fit a #8 wire nicely, all screws attached and continuous within the housing on the (brass) base of the box.

The last owner had attached a ground wire pigtail from one of the green screws to the ground wire feeding power to the transformer.

My question is should I attach the #8 wire from the niche to the lug-looking screw and also attach a wire from one of the green screws to the incoming ground from the electrical power feed?

 

[tonytoothdoc]

My understanding was that you use split bolts to connect the cut wire to the new wire, but I never received a response as to if you cover it all with some more potting compound, so I reposted it in a different form.

I apologize but I missed iyour second part that on Hayward’s box the ground screws and bonding lug are electrically connected. My question is if I connect the #8 green bonding wire from the niche, do I ALSO need to connect a ground wire from another ground screw back to the incoming ground from the power source, or keep only the green bonding wire connected to the transformer base?

 

[ajw22]

It appears that my Hayward poolside box housing the transformer has no external lug for attaching the #8 green wire running through pvc from the wet niche.

Did you look at the manual I linked to in post #3?

Show me pics of your Hayward pool side box.

The manual shows a bonding lug on the bottom of the box. It also shows different wiring depending on the type of light being used.

The last owner had attached a ground wire pigtail from one of the green screws to the ground wire feeding power to the transformer.

Show me a pic.

My question is should I attach the #8 wire from the niche to the lug-looking screw and also attach a wire from one of the green screws to the incoming ground from the electrical power feed?

Bond wire goes to bond lug.

Ground wire goes to ground bar.

 

[ajw22]

My understanding was that you use split bolts to connect the cut wire to the new wire, but I never received a response as to if you cover it all with some more potting compound, so I reposted it in a different form.

You are doing a hack. The NEC says you cannot splice ground wires in a pool light conduit. It is silent about a bonding wire. If you treat the bonding wire the same way as a ground wire then the answer is you need to run a new bonding wire. That becomes impractical so you do the best you can with a split bolt. If you can cover the splice with some potting compound all the better. Can't hurt, may help.

My question is if I connect the #8 green bonding wire from the niche, do I ALSO need to connect a ground wire from another ground screw back to the incoming ground from the power source, or keep only the green bonding wire connected to the transformer base?

Yes, all the ground wires from the power source and light need to be connected together on the ground bus. Otherwise the light is not grounded to anything.

 

[tonytoothdoc]

You are doing a hack. The NEC says you cannot splice ground wires in a pool light conduit. It is silent about a bonding wire. If you treat the bonding wire the same way as a ground wire then the answer is you need to run a new bonding wire. That becomes impractical so you do the best you can with a split bolt. If you can cover the splice with some potting compound all the better. Can't hurt, may help.



Yes, all the ground wires from the power source and light need to be connected together on the ground bus. Otherwise the light is not grounded to anything.

Thanks so much for walking me through all of this. I couldn’t find the bonding lug on the transformer housing looking at the underside from the front or sides. The back of the box is wedged against a rock wall. Finally I was able to get a photo from the underside of the rear of the transformer housing. In the photo, I was able to see the rusted, corroded lug like one of the types shown in your original pictures.

My thought is that if I can access the screw that appears to be holding the lug in place, I’ll remove it and place a new jug to attach the #8 bond wire to. If I can’t access it, will the spot I show the #8 attached to from the top view suffice ?

I also assume that I need to get rid of the wire nut and attach all grounds to the grounding screws individually in the base
of the transformer housing.

I’ve attached a photo of the wiring inside the wet niche as well and will use the split bolt to splice those #8’s and try to add potting compound around the assembly as you recommended.

Again, thanks so much for your patience and excellent information!!!

 

[ajw22]

It does not matter if the grounds are wire nutted together or all connected to the ground bus bar as long as the box ground is included in the circuit.